Does anybody else not get these kinds of people? The ones who must work all the time so their kids are raised by nannies, or the ones who shortly after the kid is born drop them off at daycares for the next 4 years before preschool, then kindergarten, and then off to 12 years of school.

And the part I really don't get, parents can't be bothered to raise their own kids because they must WORK to make the money...well how much are these baby-sitters costing them? Daycares may be a lot of things but they ain't cheap. So it seems like one of those endless running circles but in the meantime the kids are growing up hardly ever seeing their parents so what was the point in having them in the first place?

I work in a government office where most people make okay to good wages. Many of the young mothers quit with their second babies because the cost of childcare wasn't worth it. But I have to assume their husbands have medical insurance from their own jobs. That right there ~ insurance ~ is a biggie.

LOL. I don't know where you think daycares and nannies are only used to 'pawn' your kids off on, but it's not. They are there for people with careers and who want to work to have a good life for themselves and their families. They are there for help. Not everybody can (or wants) to stay home all day with children. You have to have a life too.

Nystyle709 wrote:

LOL. I don't know where you think daycares and nannies are only used to 'pawn' your kids off on, but it's not. They are there for people with careers and who want to work to have a good life for themselves and their families. They are there for help. Not everybody can (or wants) to stay home all day with children. You have to have a life too.

I find it a little hard to believe that of all the parents who do do this that there is absolutely NO other relatives who could stay home with the kids during the day instead of packing them off to day cares, which as it turns out a lot of them just sit kids in front of the TV for hours on end every day. Why would anybody want to pay $8 an hour for that privilege?

Supernova wrote:

I find it a little hard to believe that of all the parents who do do this that there is absolutely NO other relatives who could stay home with the kids during the day instead of packing them off to day cares, which as it turns out a lot of them just sit kids in front of the TV for hours on end every day. Why would anybody want to pay $8 an hour for that privilege?

My neighbor down the street charges $600 per child per month, and she watches 5 or 6 kids.

Personally, I think it's important to try and raise a child during the first few years before they start school. But, y'know, a lot of grandparents work, too, and not everyone has relatives around. We didn't.

And being a stay-at-home mom, though I recommend it for awhile, doesn't guarantee a child's outcome. I've known obnoxious brats from stay-at-home moms while I've known a few good kids from working single-parents. It's interesting.

Bluesmama wrote:

My neighbor down the street charges $600 per child per month, and she watches 5 or 6 kids.

Personally, I think it's important to try and raise a child during the first few years before they start school. But, y'know, a lot of grandparents work, too, and not everyone has relatives around. We didn't.

And being a stay-at-home mom, though I recommend it for awhile, doesn't guarantee a child's outcome. I've known obnoxious brats from stay-at-home moms while I've known a few good kids from working single-parents. It's interesting.

Oh definitely, but I also think kids need to spend a good portion of their first few years with their own families. That's where you really learn stuff before school starts and truth be told you probably learn more important stuff at home before you enter school than you will once you enter it. by the time I was 3, my great aunt who was a teacher told my mother that my brother and I were THE most well behaved kids she had ever seen. I learned to read when I was 2 years old, and no kindergarten would even have taken me until I was 6 because my birthday's so late in the year.

And when we were growing up, day care was just something you saw on TV, it was like it didn't exist in the real world, we never knew anybody that went, it seems all the kids on the block stayed home until it was time for kindergarten.

Nystyle709 wrote:

LOL. I don't know where you think daycares and nannies are only used to 'pawn' your kids off on, but it's not. They are there for people with careers and who want to work to have a good life for themselves and their families. They are there for help. Not everybody can (or wants) to stay home all day with children. You have to have a life too.

I think part of the point being made, is that the people in question never see their kids because they put their jobs and themselves first all the time. They drop them off at daycare, and get home from their workday just in time to see them off to bed, then start the process all over.

Parenting is a balance, and while parental sacrifice can only go so far, you still need to be able to live your own life and do some of the things you want, while paying attention to your kids, too. Sometimes--many times--you have to put aside something you want or one of your dreams in order to provide for your kids, but that doesn't mean you can't do it later on, or more time-appropriate based on where your kids are in their lives.

All my own career choices have been dictated by the needs of my family, and I'm still at the same employer I have been at since I was 20 years old. I've been passed over 4 times for supervisory positions because I couldn't devote the time and 24 hour availablility they wanted of me to do one of those jobs, because I chose to put my kid first. I still make damn good money, and even though I don't have the title after my name, my co-workers trust me more and look to me more than the actual supervisors, for guidance.

Someday I'll live a little more selfishly than I do now, but not until my daughter is either in college or established on her own.

Supernova wrote:

I find it a little hard to believe that of all the parents who do do this that there is absolutely NO other relatives who could stay home with the kids during the day instead of packing them off to day cares, which as it turns out a lot of them just sit kids in front of the TV for hours on end every day. Why would anybody want to pay $8 an hour for that privilege?

There are plenty of working moms and dads that have relatives taking care of their children, I know a few in my very own family. The Adults work because they have to but they have a desire to have a family as well. They spend time with the children at night and on the weekends and whenever vacation time pops up. In today's world you have to have a working husband and wife in order to survive, dosen't mean you should not have children.

Hyacinth Girl wrote:

I think part of the point being made, is that the people in question never see their kids because they put their jobs and themselves first all the time. They drop them off at daycare, and get home from their workday just in time to see them off to bed, then start the process all over..

That is NOT the case for everyone who has a nanny or who has their child in daycare.....which is what she's insinuating. Furthermore, not all daycares just plop the kids in front of the tv. I know people who have and work in daycare centers and they are very hands on with the children and are a Godsend for busy parents. It's not that parents don't want to be with their kids, but bills don't pay themselves. And nobody should have to apologize for wanting children and also wanting a career as well. If you want to have kids, being able to stay home with them shouldnt be a factor when you have resources available to help you.

Hyacinth Girl wrote:

I think part of the point being made, is that the people in question never see their kids because they put their jobs and themselves first all the time. They drop them off at daycare, and get home from their workday just in time to see them off to bed, then start the process all over.

Parenting is a balance, and while parental sacrifice can only go so far, you still need to be able to live your own life and do some of the things you want, while paying attention to your kids, too. Sometimes--many times--you have to put aside something you want or one of your dreams in order to provide for your kids, but that doesn't mean you can't do it later on, or more time-appropriate based on where your kids are in their lives.

All my own career choices have been dictated by the needs of my family, and I'm still at the same employer I have been at since I was 20 years old. I've been passed over 4 times for supervisory positions because I couldn't devote the time and 24 hour availablility they wanted of me to do one of those jobs, because I chose to put my kid first. I still make damn good money, and even though I don't have the title after my name, my co-workers trust me more and look to me more than the actual supervisors, for guidance.

Someday I'll live a little more selfishly than I do now, but not until my daughter is either in college or established on her own.

Exactly, anybody who thinks having a kid isn't going to alter how they live their lives and how they do things needs to face reality. That's one reason why I'm in no hurry to have kids because then your life as you know it is over, suddenly it's 3 A.M. wake up calls, or in my mother's case, the whole first 3 years without a single full night's sleep, and for 18 years you are responsible for another human being.

Supernova wrote:

Exactly, anybody who thinks having a kid isn't going to alter how they live their lives and how they do things needs to face reality. That's one reason why I'm in no hurry to have kids because then your life as you know it is over, suddenly it's 3 A.M. wake up calls, or in my mother's case, the whole first 3 years without a single full night's sleep, and for 18 years you are responsible for another human being.

And even if you're not legally responsible for them after that, if you're doing it right, you will always worry about them to some degree.

Alan Smithee wrote:

And even if you're not legally responsible for them after that, if you're doing it right, you will always worry about them to some degree.

Exactly, and I want to have a life before it gets put on hold for someone else. So I intend to have a few years to myself to spend it how I want, do the things I want on my own schedule before it's 3 A.M. feedings and diapers and chickenpox and school and all of that. But, long before I had kids I would make sure I was somewhat financially ready for them and that I wouldn't have to be gone 18 hours of the day to support them because I would be there to raise them otherwise what point in having them?

Nystyle709 wrote:

That is NOT the case for everyone who has a nanny or who has their child in daycare.....which is what she's insinuating. Furthermore, not all daycares just plop the kids in front of the tv. I know people who have and work in daycare centers and they are very hands on with the children and are a Godsend for busy parents. It's not that parents don't want to be with their kids, but bills don't pay themselves. And nobody should have to apologize for wanting children and also wanting a career as well. If you want to have kids, being able to stay home with them shouldnt be a factor when you have resources available to help you.

I agree with most of that, and mainly what I was focusing on is the career-hungry people who have power-workdays where they start at 5am and get home around 8 or 9pm when the kids are going off to bed--they never see them awake, practically. They're so engrossed in "Me, me me" and everyone else is along for their ride, including the kids.

I wasn't asking anyone to apologize for wanting both a career and kids--both can be done, and both can be very rewarding, but they have to be done "right" with that balance between the two, so that one doesn't suffer for the sake of the other. I think everyone is entitled to having both if they want it.

Having kids pretty much dictates the next 20 years of your life, but you also shouldn't put aside yourself, either--live a little differently for a while, then get back on the career-fast track after the kids are adults and/or mostly self sufficient.

Day care centers can be great places where the kids will learn many things and skills they will need in this life, as are the situations of stay-at-home parents. That's mostly why I chose to go on night shift and work crazy hours--so I could feel like a stay at home parent, yet still work full time. Also my daughter had too many health issues for me to want to burden a daycare place with, between cancer treatments in infancy to epilepsy that developed when she got older.

It's all in choices, and you do what you think is right at the time and hope for the best outcome.

Supernova wrote:

Exactly, and I want to have a life before it gets put on hold for someone else. So I intend to have a few years to myself to spend it how I want, do the things I want on my own schedule before it's 3 A.M. feedings and diapers and chickenpox and school and all of that. But, long before I had kids I would make sure I was somewhat financially ready for them and that I wouldn't have to be gone 18 hours of the day to support them because I would be there to raise them otherwise what point in having them?

As usual, the point just flew right over your head.

Nystyle709 wrote:

Well I'm not sure how you deduced that I made that assumption, but however you want to read into it. Seems pretty obvious that those types of people would be engaging the services of daycare/nannies/au-pairs, etc., based on the hours they put into their days, but plenty of other people who don't live for their careers, have valid reasons for using daycare and are well warranted to do so.

My point was not to classify people based on daycare use or non-use, but make the distinction on how much time and involvement they have in their kids' lives, regardless of who helps them out or doesn't help, when they're at work, and how much family and everything else takes a backseat to their jobs.

Hyacinth Girl wrote:

Well I'm not sure how you deduced that I made that assumption, but however you want to read into it. Seems pretty obvious that those types of people would be engaging the services of daycare/nannies/au-pairs, etc., based on the hours they put into their days, but plenty of other people who don't live for their careers, have valid reasons for using daycare and are well warranted to do so.

LOL. I didn't say YOU said it. But you were trying to defend her point when that's EXACTLY what she implied.

My point was not to classify people based on daycare use or non-use.

Ding ding ding. This is what my original statement was referring to.

It is idealistic to think that both parents don't want to or don't have to work full time. Working full time does not equate to 12 hour work days.

Family looking after a child is ideal, but today, grandparents are still working full time when the kids are young because they have to.

I am so anti-facility daycare that I found a way to earn money at home so that I could raise my son because I didn't have family to watch him but I still had to earn a dime.

RedBedroom wrote:

It is idealistic to think that both parents don't want to or don't have to work full time. Working full time does not equate to 12 hour work days.

Family looking after a child is ideal, but today, grandparents are still working full time when the kids are young because they have to.

I am so anti-facility daycare that I found a way to earn money at home so that I could raise my son because I didn't have family to watch him but I still had to earn a dime.

I commend you, RB. My mother also took jobs she could do from home so she could earn money while she home schooled us, so I know how hard that can be. When we were in college we were interviewed about our experiences in homeschooling and apparently there's a school of thought that parents get PAID to do it, and I'm here to tell you they do NOT, books cost $1,000 a grade so you had to be financially set for it.

And if you don't mind my asking, what was it exactly that turned you off from sending your kid to day care?

Supernova wrote:

I commend you, RB. My mother also took jobs she could do from home so she could earn money while she home schooled us, so I know how hard that can be. When we were in college we were interviewed about our experiences in homeschooling and apparently there's a school of thought that parents get PAID to do it, and I'm here to tell you they do NOT, books cost $1,000 a grade so you had to be financially set for it.

And if you don't mind my asking, what was it exactly that turned you off from sending your kid to day care?

Super, I don't mind you asking anything.

A big thing is I despise facility daycare. I could not find an adequate in-home daycare, but had I found one, maybe things would have gone a different way.

Anyway, what I despise about facility daycare is that they seemed to prey on the fact that my son's dad owned his own business, so he was called at LEAST ONE TIME PER WEEK to pick up our healthy son due to a fever, runny nose, crabbiness, and loose stool. Our son was healthy yet once they knew he owned his own business, they called all the time at the end of the day, making it blatantly obvious they were just trying to reduce the child count to get staff sent home early.

This was probably just the center and would not have been the case had we gone somewhere else. But we were under contract with them. It was a nightmare. We took our son to the doctor for issues such as impetigo with the physician to only laugh at our "new parent paranoia." And all the visits we had to make to the doc were per the direction of the center. They were the most local (I could walk there and breast feed during lunch) and most highly regarded. So, when my son was one year old, and "graduated" to the one year old room, we were happy to maybe not get so many calls about taking him home.

Then a girl who began at the dental office I worked in told me that she saw an injury my son had. I don't even recall the injury, that is how insignificant it was..yet after that injury, we were made to keep him home for a day. My son's dad and I sat home and were not sure what to do, when I decided to give up the new car payment and find a way to stay at home with my son.

My son's dad was beginning a new business at that point, so it was rough for us both to be without benefits, but we did it.

Supernova, just understand that what I decided to do does not work for everyone. There are times I wish I didn't have to be writing at 3:30 when my son comes home....it would be easier if he was at "daycare."

Working at home is not the solution for everyone. For those that it is, is a true blessing.

I know it's not for everyone but there are a couple of things that I have noticed over the years: both homeschooling and at-home businesses seem to be on the rise, coincidence perhaps but I think a lot more parents are getting tired of the morons who run the day cares and the schools and taking an alternative route to settle the matter for themselves. The part that I find so hard to believe is how is it that the kids who go to day care or preschool, seem to have more brains than the people running them?

Super you have posted enough about the nonsensical things from you district, so I have no clue how things would go for the average family by you.