CC33

Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

CC33


+9
CatEyes10736
CeCe
RiteDiva
Alan Smithee
Shale
Forgiveness Man
Chris
Marc™
Supernova
13 posters

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Supernova
    Supernova
    The Book Chamber
    The Book Chamber


    Female
    Join date : 2010-06-22
    Posts : 11954
    Rep : 182

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Supernova Sun Jan 23, 2011 2:46 am

    Has anybody heard of this case?

    http://www.wtae.com/r/26542836/detail.html

    A doctor who gave abortions to minorities, immigrants and poor women in what the Philadelphia district attorney called a "house of horrors" clinic was charged with eight counts of murder Wednesday for the deaths of a patient and seven babies who the DA said were born alive and killed with scissors.

    Dr. Kermit Gosnell, 69, made millions of dollars over 30 years as he performed many illegal, late-term abortions, District Attorney Seth Williams said.

    Steven E. Massof, of Mt. Lebanon, was arrested Wednesday by Allegheny County district attorney's detectives. Williams said Massof worked for Gosnell and pretended to be a doctor and will be charged with murder, theft by deception and conspiracy and drug violations for illegally dispensing narcotics.

    Gosnell "induced labor, forced the live birth of viable babies in the sixth, seventh, eighth month of pregnancy and then killed those babies by cutting into the back of the neck with scissors and severing their spinal cord," Williams said.


    Massof's home in Mt. Lebanon

    Patients were subjected to squalid conditions at Gosnell's Women's Medical Society, where Gosnell performed dozens of abortions a day, prosecutors said. He mostly worked overnight hours after his untrained staff administered drugs to induce labor during the day, they said.

    Bags and bottles holding aborted fetuses "were scattered throughout the building," Williams said. "There were jars, lining shelves, with severed feet that he kept for no medical purpose."

    Four of Gosnell's workers were charged with murder. Five other people -- including Massof -- were charged with controlled drug violations and other crimes. None of the employees had any medical training, and one was a high school student who performed intravenous anesthesia with potentially lethal narcotics, Williams said.

    "Obviously, these allegations are very, very serious," said defense lawyer William J. Brennan, who represented Gosnell during the investigation. He noted that the doctor served patients in a low-income city neighborhood for decades.

    Online Documents: Read The Grand Jury Report

    Prosecutors said Gosnell charged $325 for first-trimester abortions and $1,600 to $3,000 for abortions up to 30 weeks. Abortions are legal up to 24 weeks gestation in Pennsylvania, although most doctors won't perform them after 20 weeks, prosecutors said.

    Few if any of the sedated women knew their babies were born alive and then killed, prosecutors said. Many were first-time mothers who were told they were 24 weeks pregnant, even if they were further along, authorities said.

    "He does not know how to do an abortion. He's not board certified," Assistant District Attorney Joanne Pescatore said. "Once he got them there, he saw dollar signs and did abortions that other people wouldn't do."



    By show of hands, who would like to see this guy get the death penalty, and who personally wouldn't mind being present at his execution? soap box How ANYBODY can justify what this guy has done is beyond me, and there are, there have been people saying 'its no big deal, it's just one isolated case', yeah tell us that when YOU'RE on the receiving end of that isolated case. Apparently nobody had bothered to check up on or investigate this guy's 'clinic' in about 13 years, why the hell not? And some of his 'patients' who survived are telling now that even when they said they didn't want an abortion, he said he didn't have time for their complaints and hit them and tied them down and did it anyway. Now, of course the first question to this is WHY didn't any of them call the police? Apparently this shit has been going on for years and nobody thought to report it, why? That's what I want to know. WHY if these reports are true, and they did find that nobody in that place has ANY idea what they're doing, HUNDREDS of babies' body parts kept in jars for no reason, so it's hardly just an allegation by somebody with a grudge to bear, so if it's true, WHY has this bastard been allowed to go on with his Mengele-esque ways for so long? That's what I want to know.
    Marc™
    Marc™
    …is a Chamber DEITY.
    …is a Chamber DEITY.


    Male
    Join date : 2010-01-30
    Location : Michigan
    Posts : 12006
    Rep : 212

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Marc™ Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:49 am

    Sick. I'm generally not FOR the death penalty, but wouldn't argue against it here....too bad this will just be used as fodder for the rabid anti-abortionists.
    Chris
    Chris
    Chamber Admin.
    Chamber Admin.


    Male
    Join date : 2010-01-30
    Location : Oak Park, Michigan
    Posts : 23201
    Rep : 330

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Chris Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:08 am

    Horrific.

    I'm speechless.
    Forgiveness Man
    Forgiveness Man
    …is a Chamber Royal.
    …is a Chamber Royal.


    Male
    Join date : 2010-06-25
    Location : Chilling on your sofa
    Posts : 6657
    Rep : 153

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Forgiveness Man Sun Jan 23, 2011 9:26 am

    Marc, they don't have to use it as fodder; it serves itself.

    I really want to act all surprised but really, I am not. I'm just like, somebody is finally paying attention? It is horrible and I am horrified, but the sad thing is that it isn't the isolated incident it'll come off as.
    Shale
    Shale
    ...is a Chamber Royal.
    ...is a Chamber Royal.


    Male
    Join date : 2010-09-27
    Location : Miami Beach
    Posts : 9699
    Rep : 219

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Shale Sun Jan 23, 2011 10:43 am

    Marc™ wrote:...too bad this will just be used as fodder for the rabid anti-abortionists.
    Actually, to counter argue, this is what to expect when abortion becomes illegal. This guy was operating illegally in the dark shadows of everyone's denial. This is like the infamous coat hangar, back alley abortions done in the days of illegal abortion.

    This is why we need legit clinics without harassing scared young girls who need to terminate a pregnancy that they are unprepared for.

    Questions unanswered - Why these women went to this guy and paid big bucks when legit clinics could offer so much more? Why did they wait so late-term before seeking abortion?
    Forgiveness Man
    Forgiveness Man
    …is a Chamber Royal.
    …is a Chamber Royal.


    Male
    Join date : 2010-06-25
    Location : Chilling on your sofa
    Posts : 6657
    Rep : 153

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Forgiveness Man Sun Jan 23, 2011 10:57 am

    ^^^^Yet here abortion is, perfectly legal, and it still went on. So clearly the legality of abortion doesn't stop it. It's just the nature of it.
    Supernova
    Supernova
    The Book Chamber
    The Book Chamber


    Female
    Join date : 2010-06-22
    Posts : 11954
    Rep : 182

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Supernova Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:40 am

    That's the part that I really don't get, abortion IS legal in this country, so WHY was this place in business when this guy clearly couldn't bother getting anybody to work with who had actually gotten a medical degree, license, etc.?
    Alan Smithee
    Alan Smithee
    ...is a 20G Chamber DIETY.
    ...is a 20G Chamber DIETY.


    Male
    Join date : 2010-09-03
    Location : 40º44’18.33”N 73º58’31.82”W
    Posts : 25792
    Rep : 381

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Alan Smithee Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:47 am

    The person in charge and (arguably those who aided him) is a monster and should suffer the full penalty of the law.
    Forgiveness Man
    Forgiveness Man
    …is a Chamber Royal.
    …is a Chamber Royal.


    Male
    Join date : 2010-06-25
    Location : Chilling on your sofa
    Posts : 6657
    Rep : 153

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Forgiveness Man Sun Jan 23, 2011 12:00 pm

    Supernova wrote:That's the part that I really don't get, abortion IS legal in this country, so WHY was this place in business when this guy clearly couldn't bother getting anybody to work with who had actually gotten a medical degree, license, etc.?
    Philly is hardly short on abortion facilities too. It's not like he was their only option. It's just sad reality of our culture.
    RiteDiva
    RiteDiva
    …is an Up 'N Comer.
    …is an Up 'N Comer.


    Female
    Join date : 2010-02-11
    Posts : 222
    Rep : 8

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by RiteDiva Sun Jan 23, 2011 2:11 pm

    This is a story that is totally gruesome. I also read that he was using a 15 year old kid as his medical assistant, doing the anesthesia. I hope he ends up in prison for the rest of his life, with all his assets going to pay off each of the malpractice suits.
    CeCe
    CeCe
    …is a Chamber DEITY.
    …is a Chamber DEITY.


    Join date : 2010-06-30
    Posts : 11962
    Rep : 326

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by CeCe Sun Jan 23, 2011 3:09 pm

    This guy should be in prison the. rest. of. his. life.
    CatEyes10736
    CatEyes10736
    …is a Power Member.
    …is a Power Member.


    Female
    Join date : 2010-01-31
    Location : Portland, Oregon
    Posts : 2665
    Rep : 126

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by CatEyes10736 Sun Jan 23, 2011 4:45 pm

    This story makes me want to vomit.

    Trying to imagine a healthcare provider playing with a premature baby before killing it and the only thing that comes to mind is that this is like a serial killer playground. Take the politics out of it and it turns into a horror movie. Complete with the body parts in bags in the freezer ala Jeffrey Dahmer.

    If this story stops with Grosnell and company, then you can truly know just how medically corrupt states can be on multiple levels.
    TPP
    TPP
    …is a Power Member.
    …is a Power Member.


    Female
    Join date : 2010-12-22
    Posts : 1497
    Rep : 69

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by TPP Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:18 pm

    I read about it the other day. It makes me sick.
    Forgiveness Man
    Forgiveness Man
    …is a Chamber Royal.
    …is a Chamber Royal.


    Male
    Join date : 2010-06-25
    Location : Chilling on your sofa
    Posts : 6657
    Rep : 153

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Forgiveness Man Sun Jan 23, 2011 6:49 pm

    CatEyes10736 wrote:Take the politics out of it and it turns into a horror movie.
    Indeed.
    TPP
    TPP
    …is a Power Member.
    …is a Power Member.


    Female
    Join date : 2010-12-22
    Posts : 1497
    Rep : 69

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by TPP Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:04 pm

    Supernova wrote:That's the part that I really don't get, abortion IS legal in this country, so WHY was this place in business when this guy clearly couldn't bother getting anybody to work with who had actually gotten a medical degree, license, etc.?

    I have read that there is only one late term abortion doctor in America now, and he gets death threats and stuff like that every day. Supposedly he's very strict about what patients he accepts, since the law is very strict about late term abortion?? In the article I read the couple in question was pregnant with a baby who had some severe defect that wouldn't kill it after birth right away but would cause the baby to live years in pain basically in a semi coma or something like that. I am pro-life (not the kind who pickets, the kind who would NEVER get an abortion herself) and I felt really sorry for the couple in the article and understood why they made the choice they did. They didn't find the problem until after 20 weeks, and then they struggled with what to do so she was like 24 weeks, which is far enough along that it's late term and a baby born prematurely at this gestation could survive with intervention. It was just really sad all around.

    So my point is, maybe it's not as easy as it seems for some people to get an abortion that they feel they need?

    Regardless of that though, the article about the horror doctor said that some women were told they weren't as far along as they were! So that probably wouldn't apply...
    Forgiveness Man
    Forgiveness Man
    …is a Chamber Royal.
    …is a Chamber Royal.


    Male
    Join date : 2010-06-25
    Location : Chilling on your sofa
    Posts : 6657
    Rep : 153

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Forgiveness Man Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:14 pm

    thepossiblepolice wrote:So my point is, maybe it's not as easy as it seems for some people to get an abortion that they feel they need?
    They didn't start out 9 months pregnant. And the women in this clinic all got what they came in for.
    TPP
    TPP
    …is a Power Member.
    …is a Power Member.


    Female
    Join date : 2010-12-22
    Posts : 1497
    Rep : 69

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by TPP Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:19 pm

    Forgiveness Man wrote:
    thepossiblepolice wrote:So my point is, maybe it's not as easy as it seems for some people to get an abortion that they feel they need?
    They didn't start out 9 months pregnant. And the women in this clinic all got what they came in for.

    I understand someone who is pro-life thinking that way. I still have compassion for the women though, who were led to believe that they were less far along than they were. Who probably thought it would be a painless procedure for their babies...Maybe I'm naive, but I can't imagine someone knowing that it was going to be done THAT way, and still going through with it. I also can't imagine a circumstance where I would have a late term abortion though, so it's hard for me to imagine them going through with that either.
    Supernova
    Supernova
    The Book Chamber
    The Book Chamber


    Female
    Join date : 2010-06-22
    Posts : 11954
    Rep : 182

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Supernova Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:20 pm

    They didn't come in though to be beaten and strapped down against their will, one of his patients was a 15 year old whose grandmother forced her to go, she said she didn't want it, but the doctor didn't listen and just did it anyway.


    Now, one thing I can't figure out though is one of his victims has said when she went, she saw women sitting in blood soaked recliners...she said she went to him because picketers had scared her away from another place...I have to agree with people on this one, HOW can you be scared away by people carrying signs and chanting but NOT be scared away by women sitting in blood soaked furniture?
    Forgiveness Man
    Forgiveness Man
    …is a Chamber Royal.
    …is a Chamber Royal.


    Male
    Join date : 2010-06-25
    Location : Chilling on your sofa
    Posts : 6657
    Rep : 153

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Forgiveness Man Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:25 pm

    ^^^^I agree Supernova. If picketers scare you but soaking in blood doesn't, I think the thing you were really scared of isn't people with signs.

    thepossiblepolice wrote:
    Forgiveness Man wrote:They didn't start out 9 months pregnant. And the women in this clinic all got what they came in for.

    I understand someone who is pro-life thinking that way. I still have compassion for the women though, who were led to believe that they were less far along than they were. Who probably thought it would be a painless procedure for their babies...Maybe I'm naive, but I can't imagine someone knowing that it was going to be done THAT way, and still going through with it. I also can't imagine a circumstance where I would have a late term abortion though, so it's hard for me to imagine them going through with that either.
    I never said not to have compassion for the women. I have a lot of compassion for many of the women for many reasons.

    What does puzzle me is why everyone here is really upset. I know why I am. I just am curious as to why everyone else here(cept for Supernova) is.
    TPP
    TPP
    …is a Power Member.
    …is a Power Member.


    Female
    Join date : 2010-12-22
    Posts : 1497
    Rep : 69

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by TPP Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:42 pm

    Forgiveness Man wrote:^^^^I agree Supernova. If picketers scare you but soaking in blood doesn't, I think the thing you were really scared of isn't people with signs.

    thepossiblepolice wrote:

    I understand someone who is pro-life thinking that way. I still have compassion for the women though, who were led to believe that they were less far along than they were. Who probably thought it would be a painless procedure for their babies...Maybe I'm naive, but I can't imagine someone knowing that it was going to be done THAT way, and still going through with it. I also can't imagine a circumstance where I would have a late term abortion though, so it's hard for me to imagine them going through with that either.
    I never said not to have compassion for the women. I have a lot of compassion for many of the women for many reasons.

    What does puzzle me is why everyone here is really upset. I know why I am. I just am curious as to why everyone else here(cept for Supernova) is.


    I'm upset because I think late term abortion is wrong in almost all circumstances. I'm upset that there are abortions AT ALL, and on top of that I'm upset that poor innocent babies were tortured. I'm upset that the women were treated the way they were treated, I'm upset that the guy was in practice so long, I'm upset that he had all those body parts in his house like some kind of macabre museum and women still felt desperate enough to go to him. I'm upset for all the reasons that the women felt that desperate, I find it hard to believe that they just didn't want their baby at the last minute and I feel like it HAD to be really sad circumstances that put them there, even though I am upset with them for choosing to kill their innocent unborn babies who were definitely far enough along in development, imo, to be beyond debate about whether they are "people" or not by all but the most ardent pro-choice supporters.

    I'm upset that all those people were working in his practice with no medical experience, I'm upset for all the other women and babies that we don't even know about, I'm upset that people that "evil" roam the earth...


    The WHOLE thing upsets me in more ways than I can count...It's very, very disturbing.

    Forgiveness Man
    Forgiveness Man
    …is a Chamber Royal.
    …is a Chamber Royal.


    Male
    Join date : 2010-06-25
    Location : Chilling on your sofa
    Posts : 6657
    Rep : 153

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Forgiveness Man Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:49 pm

    ^^^^^Okay, thanks for the response. I agree with your reasons for the most part. The thing that makes this whole situation scary is that it isn't just an isolated incident.
    TPP
    TPP
    …is a Power Member.
    …is a Power Member.


    Female
    Join date : 2010-12-22
    Posts : 1497
    Rep : 69

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by TPP Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:50 pm

    Forgiveness Man wrote:^^^^^Okay, thanks for the response. I agree with your reasons for the most part. The thing that makes this whole situation scary is that it isn't just an isolated incident.

    That's really sad sad
    Forgiveness Man
    Forgiveness Man
    …is a Chamber Royal.
    …is a Chamber Royal.


    Male
    Join date : 2010-06-25
    Location : Chilling on your sofa
    Posts : 6657
    Rep : 153

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Forgiveness Man Sun Jan 23, 2011 7:52 pm

    ^^^^You're right. It is sad. What makes me sadder is that I'm not even shocked at hearing this story at all. I'm horrified and disturbed, saddened greatly, but I'm not shocked.
    Supernova
    Supernova
    The Book Chamber
    The Book Chamber


    Female
    Join date : 2010-06-22
    Posts : 11954
    Rep : 182

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Supernova Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:20 pm

    I'm with TPP, I'm not for abortion, I can understand it in cases where the mother WAS raped and doesn't want it OR if her health and life is at risk if she carries to full term. UNFORTUNATELY it's been reported that these make up for 2% of ALL abortions performed so when people say that's why it should be legal for all those poor women, the reason is the minority so mostly we just have women who don't like the consequences of their actions.


    Now, I don't agree with but can understand getting an abortion as early on as possible if you really don't want it, but late term, I don't get this at all. After a certain point an unborn baby CAN survive outside of the womb if it has to, if it's developed enough it can survive outside of the womb, WHY can't it count as a human life? Women can go into labor at 7 months, and when the baby comes out it's a person, so why if she's 8 months or almost at 9 months along, and the baby can still live outside of her, is it dismissed as being less than human? That makes no sense, AND, if she is that far along, why abort it, why not just get a C-section and give it up for adoption when you've already gone that far?

    Now I'm sure in some very RARE cases it can be a matter of her health but by that point you can't just chop it up and suck it out through a vacuum tube like in the first trimester or whatever, so why would an emergency C-section or inducing labor suddenly be so impossible since they're going to be getting the baby out anyway?
    Forgiveness Man
    Forgiveness Man
    …is a Chamber Royal.
    …is a Chamber Royal.


    Male
    Join date : 2010-06-25
    Location : Chilling on your sofa
    Posts : 6657
    Rep : 153

    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Forgiveness Man Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:22 pm

    ^^^^Cause the intentions, Supernova, just aren't as noble as they're advertised.

    Sponsored content


    Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck Empty Re: Abortionist charged in 8 murders, 7 born babies killed with scissors to the neck

    Post by Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Sun May 12, 2024 4:59 am