Gay kids coming out in school

What's your opinion of gay kids coming out in school; should it be encouraged?

If an eleven, twelve, thirteen, fourteen year old child knows that they are gay, should they reveal it at school, and furthermore be encouraged to have boyfriend/girlfriends?

If there was enough support from the community (parents, friends, school) I don’t think anyone should live in a closet. Unfortunately I don’t have any confidence that we’ve evolved enough where such support is universal to give a safe haven. I fear we would risk too many Matthew Shepard cases at the hands of thugs and bigots.

It actually was easier for me once I did come out.

Absolutely yes I do. It's also good that the other kids are exposed to this so that gayness becomes less unfamiliar and stigmatized. Hopefully from there by the time they are the adults running the country, the tone will be more tolerant of people who aren't status quo.

alan smithee wrote:If there was enough support from the community (parents, friends, school) I don’t think anyone should live in a closet. Unfortunately I don’t have any confidence that we’ve evolved enough where such support is universal to give a safe haven. I fear we would risk too many Matthew Shepard cases at the hands of thugs and bigots.

Yeah, it would be nice if the environment were conducive to openly gay kids being visible, but I fear for kids being bullied by their peers and prejudiced adults who are supposed to protect them in the setting just sitting idly by while it happens.

Someday it may get better.

Maybe if enuf of those oversized jocks on the football team would come out ...

alan smithee wrote:If there was enough support from the community (parents, friends, school) I don’t think anyone should live in a closet. Unfortunately I don’t have any confidence that we’ve evolved enough where such support is universal to give a safe haven. I fear we would risk too many Matthew Shepard cases at the hands of thugs and bigots.

stonestatic wrote:Absolutely yes I do. It's also good that the other kids are exposed to this so that gayness becomes less unfamiliar and stigmatized. Hopefully from there by the time they are the adults running the country, the tone will be more tolerant of people who aren't status quo.

My opinion on this is split. On the one hand, I agree with alan smithee in that there is not enough in the way of support for openly gay youth for me to "encourage" them comming out. Ultimately, gay people have to come out when they are ready and not everyone is ready to do that at such a young age. I applaud those individuals that are, but I know personally that I couldn't have come out at that age and it would have done more harm than good in some ways due to the environment I grew up in. I don't think its quite as bad today as it was 15 years ago, but that is also dependent on where you live. There have been to many cases of teen suicides due to anti gay bullying for me to fully endorse gay youth comming out.

Somehow I feel that these are worth watching again:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gm0Numi1PzM&feature=related
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=An7mdixmjjU&feature=relmfu
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_X2_BSNCOI&feature=relmfu

There are also other things to consider like whether or not their own family will accept them the way they are. Some kids don't come out for that reason alone. On the other hand stonestatic does have a point in that the more gay kids come out, the more they will be accepted into the mainstream and thus the less stigmatized it will be. It's a catch 22. I am glad that there are a lot more gay kids comming out at a younger age (for exactly that reason) but I don't necessarily think it should be something that is "encouraged" for all of them.

But I know that this kid in particular is definetely an inspiration for me:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KaOIIwmVbzw

Honestly I wouldn't recommend it before high school and only if the kid has a steady group of open-minded friends and the environment overall is one that will embrace or protect him from inevitable bullies and shit talkers.

Chris wrote:What's your opinion of gay kids coming out in school; should it be encouraged?

If an eleven, twelve, thirteen, fourteen year old child knows that they are gay, should they reveal it at school, and furthermore be encouraged to have boyfriend/girlfriends?

I think it depends on the school environment. It would be wonderful if all the gays could live in a community where homosexuality was accepted, but a lot of places are homophobic and bigoted. I think it should be encouraged if the gay kid would be accepted for who he/she was, but if not, I would keep quiet and try and save my skin. As a previous poster mentioned, we don't want anymore Matthew Shepherd cases.

It would be ideal for them to come out, to have a chance to date like other teens, but this isn't an ideal world. I think it says a lot about how backwards this country is where you can't even be who you are.

I honestly think that sexuality, heterosexual or homosexual, should be kept separate from school, period. (ESPECIALLY before High School)

Forgiveness Man wrote:I honestly think that sexuality, heterosexual or homosexual, should be kept separate from school, period. (ESPECIALLY before High School)

Unfortunately, sexuality is a part of growing up (always has been) and that pretty much makes it a part of EVERY school. Thats why they started teaching sex education many years ago, so yours is not a very realisitc point of view.

I wouldn't trust any middle school or early high school environment to be progressive enough to accommodate such a thing.

Marc™ wrote:I wouldn't trust any middle school or early high school environment to be progressive enough to accommodate such a thing.

Could you elaborate on that a little?

Wow, there are definitely a lot of ideas here, and that's great to see. I recently wrote a note about this on FB about my experiences with forgiveness, which involved this. Me coming out in high school(14) was extremely terrifying. In the process, I drifted apart from one of my best friends, and the other was a douchebag- he turned his back on me. It wasn't a great time for me, and I actually wanted to die. I pondered suicide so much out of fear, and sadness, and anger- I was just in a very bad place. And one person, a lesbian, was so sweet and so kind to me that she taught me to find strength in adversity. And it was a very powerful message for me.

And I believe that every young person who comes out of the closet and makes it through learns that lesson. In fact, I believe that they begin to see life for what it truly is. And it's these people who learn early on that you can make the world happy, but you can make yourself happy. Because if you don't, who the hell's going to? You have to love yourself and appreciate yourself for it- otherwise, you'll grow up to be like so many married men who go into chat forums, and hook-up with guys, possibly bringing home an STD to your wife. I should know- I have a cousin who lost both of his parents because of his father's secret life and the risks he took- AIDS is a killer.

It's not something I would encourage or discourage. If your school is in a conservative or volatile area, where kids are getting beat up and tortured for even being perceived as being gay, then the answer should be obvious. If your school has social clubs geared towards gays and lesbians, then proceed with caution.

captainbryce wrote:

Forgiveness Man wrote:I honestly think that sexuality, heterosexual or homosexual, should be kept separate from school, period. (ESPECIALLY before High School)

Unfortunately, sexuality is a part of growing up (always has been) and that pretty much makes it a part of EVERY school. Thats why they started teaching sex education many years ago, so yours is not a very realisitc point of view.

I feel it plenty realistic. School isn't a place to come out of the closet or flaunt romances. I feel it plenty realistic if we stop treating school as some place for kids to just hang out all day and meet people.

Forgiveness Man wrote:

captainbryce wrote:Unfortunately, sexuality is a part of growing up (always has been) and that pretty much makes it a part of EVERY school. Thats why they started teaching sex education many years ago, so yours is not a very realisitc point of view.

I feel it plenty realistic. School isn't a place to come out of the closet or flaunt romances. I feel it plenty realistic if we stop treating school as some place for kids to just hang out all day and meet people.

You're proceeding from a false assumption in two different ways. First of all let me ask you this: What does "flaunting romances" have to do a gay kid comming out? Your point seems dependent on the basis of linking the two, so in all honesty what does one thing have to do with the other? Secondly, school is about more than just learning the basics of math and english and its more than just about passing tests and getting a peice of paper. School is also about social development and teaching children how to be able to interact in a social environment, which is something that they will most definetley need in the real world. We teach children about different cultures (and their own culture), respect, morals, ethics, law, human development, conflict resolution, etc. It's not just about learning to do your numbers! It's about learning how to adjust to the real world.

^^^^I never said it had anything to do with it. My point was that I am against sexual displays in school period, regardless of whether or not they are gay or straight or whatever. I never said they were linked, so no false assumption there.

I never saw that as the purpose of school. School is to LEARN. Kids can be taught how to develop in a social environment many places. If anything, I'd argue school is likely among the least effective places to learn social skills. It's certainly been my observation that school does little to aid a person's social skillets.

School hasn't taught kids how to adjust to the real world in a very long time. It's sad but it's how it is.

I think that if they want to, they should. The more gay kids come out, the more accepted it will be. However, it's not their cross to bare if they aren't comfortable coming out. They are the best judge of how their peers will react and if they aren't comfortable, then chances are they would be bullied or mistreated, imo.

It's like breastfeeding in public. I feel strongly that the more women bf in public, the more "normal" and accepted it will become. Right now some women are treated badly when they do it, so it's a risk. I can take the heat, but some women can't, for whatever reason and that is okay too.

The difference is we are talking about something that isn't an activity, it's WHO someone is. They are a gay teenager, it's not an option to be gay or not to be gay, so accepting that they might be bullied and using that as a reason why they shouldn't come out really isn't acceptable imo. It shouldn't even be an issue. They should be accepted for who they are, period.

Forgiveness Man wrote:^^^^I never said it had anything to do with it. My point was that I am against sexual displays in school period, regardless of whether or not they are gay or straight or whatever. I never said they were linked, so no false assumption there.

It is a false assumption. Here is the part you obviously don't understand. YOU DIDN'T HAVE TO, link the two together. It's implied by the fact that you brought them both up together. Now, that may not have been your intentions, but its what you did. Because nobody is discussing "sexual displays" except you. The topic of conversation was What's your opinion of gay kids coming out in school. Your justification for being against it was that sexuality should be kept out of school. I just demonstrated that to be unrealistic. Now you are talking about sexual displays (something that has nothing to do with the topic) and relating it to the topic of sexual orientation. This is where critical thinking comes in. If we are discussing sexuality in school as it pertains to orientation, why are you talking about "flaunting romances" unless it was your intention to relate the two to each other? Again, you didn't have to say that they were linked. That is the conclusion one would naturally draw from your sentence after looking down the thread.

Forgiveness Man wrote:I never saw that as the purpose of school. School is to LEARN. Kids can be taught how to develop in a social environment many places. If anything, I'd argue school is likely among the least effective places to learn social skills. It's certainly been my observation that school does little to aid a person's social skillets.

And yes you COULD argue that, but for all intents and purposes you'd be wrong (according to most bodies of education). School IS a place to learn, but one of the primary things that is learned in school is social skills, which is crucial to the ability of children to develop into productive and functional members of society. In fact, school is the PRIMARY way that most children experience adapting to real world social situations and it's one of the arguments against home schooling. And if you look at the mission statement of 99.9 percent of schools out there (public and private) you are likely to see a reference made to the social development of children. Take a look see:
http://education.wayne.edu/wholeschooling/WS/WSPrncples/WS%200%20purpose%20schls.html

With regard to your personal obersvations about school, it is unfortunate that you haven't seen a school's attempt to aid the social development of their students, but that really has more to do with (for lack of a better word) PEOPLE LIKE YOU, who think that sex education shouldn't be in school, or that it should be limited to "abstenance only" curriculum. It is those types that hinder the schools ability to effectively administer social development in children. Yet at the same time such people also feel that elements of religion (intellegent design) should be taught in school as science. Its a major contradiction because religious elements are in fact based on sociological factors, not scientific ones. But this is really getting way off track here. The point is, school has the primary purpose of prepairing children for citizenship, and part of being a productive citizen in our country is having social skills. Again, it's not just about learning to do your numbers!

Forgiveness Man wrote:School hasn't taught kids how to adjust to the real world in a very long time. It's sad but it's how it is.

Be that as it may, that no reason to prepetuate the "sad" fact by ensuring it continues that way. So even if you believe that about schools, what you are doing is essentially saying that it should remain that way.