This needs a thread of its own...should schools stay open till 7 P.M., on weekends and longer in summer?

We got into this discussion on the thread about scientifically designing babies but it really needs a place of its own...

What are your thoughts on Obama's idea that public schools need to have their days be expanded to 7 o' clock at night, open on weekends and cut shorter than usual the summer breaks? Keep in mind his own daughters will NEVER have to follow these kinds of regulations, oh no, it's only everybody else's kid who has to follow his rules if they go into effect.

With ideas like this I just gotta wonder why they don't come out and say what they're really thinking? That kids MUST be kept away from the home environment and their parents and any kind of a life outside of school, as much as possible? Gee, I think I recall reading about such a thing discussed in Fahrenheit 451 which was written almost 60 years ago, talk about foreshadowing.

Sounds way too experimental and far fetched, IMO.

Yeah, but then again so does eliminating recess and making kids spend that much more time sitting down 'studying'. But the fact remains they've already done that in half of the elementary schools in the country; despite the fact that every study shows kids who are deprived of recess and that break and ability to get out, run around and shake the cobwebs from their mind, do worse in school because they don't get that short break between classes to let off steam and build up energy.
Another reason why I'd homeschool my kids; we never lost our breaks because of something like budget cuts or it was a new thing for the school to try, and the breaks never interfered with our studying and ability to do well on tests.

I think it's as dumb as(yeah, I said it before and I am saying it again) bathing in mud for a longer period of time, hoping to get cleaner. The problem is not the quantity of the education, it's the quality of the education that suffers, and making kids stay in these schools longer will do more harm than good. But hey, the idea is coming from Obama, so I shouldn't expect it to make sense.

Kids need to run and let off steam. They need time to be creative, or just to chill. They need time to freaking be kids. I honestly think this is just to give parents more free daycare and give the schools more time to teach the kids what THEY want instead of letting the kids have a home life.

Sorry, but the idea just SUCKS on all angles and I don't see one rational reason for it. It won't make kids smarter, just more stressed. But again, given the source, it doesn't surprise me.

And again I gotta ask. You go to school at 8 in the morning, if school doesn't let out until 7, then you have homework, and if you're in sports or debate or another extra curricular activity, when in the whole damn day are you going to have time to do something you want, or to hang out with your friends, or do something with your family? Or is having a life secondary to scoring higher on tests than Chinese students who shame the family if they don't make perfect marks?

^^^^I honestly think kids will score lower on tests if they don't have time to breathe. You're right that kids won't have time to live if they spend 11 hours a day in school. If school becomes their entire life, it will just end up becoming counter-productive. If we want smarter kids, let's teach them better instead of contriving silly ideas to make it look like you're trying harder than you really are. If these schools aren't teaching our kids well enough, we want them to spend less time there, not more.

Exactly, I think if school days WERE expanded by another 4 hours every day, and weekends, there would be a large increase rate of students (who are old enough anyway) dropping out. If I had suddenly been told I needed to spend 4 more hours a day on schoolwork, that wouldn't have encouraged me to do anything in the way of working harder. And a lot of kids already eat lunch AND breakfast at school, are they suddenly going to be getting all 3 meals at school? Then why ever go home at the end of the day just to go to bed?

^^^^It's all about trying to destroy the family. It's a stupid idea.

Supernova wrote:We got into this discussion on the thread about scientifically designing babies but it really needs a place of its own...

What are your thoughts on Obama's idea that public schools need to have their days be expanded to 7 o' clock at night, open on weekends and cut shorter than usual the summer breaks? Keep in mind his own daughters will NEVER have to follow these kinds of regulations, oh no, it's only everybody else's kid who has to follow his rules if they go into effect.

With ideas like this I just gotta wonder why they don't come out and say what they're really thinking? That kids MUST be kept away from the home environment and their parents and any kind of a life outside of school, as much as possible? Gee, I think I recall reading about such a thing discussed in Fahrenheit 451 which was written almost 60 years ago, talk about foreshadowing.

What's his justification for this? Other than the obvious that it will somehow help kids learn more. I think it's a terrible idea and will only make kids (and teachers) more restless and irritable, and from there nothing is accomplished. Oh well if this happens then I'm glad I'm done with school.

^^^^More time to keep kids away from parents and indoctrinate them more. xD

I imagine they'd not overwork the teachers. They'd never do anything to piss them off. We can overwork the kids but they'd never overwork the teachers.

stonestatic wrote:What's his justification for this? Other than the obvious that it will somehow help kids learn more. I think it's a terrible idea and will only make kids (and teachers) more restless and irritable, and from there nothing is accomplished. Oh well if this happens then I'm glad I'm done with school.

Well he came up with this one either early this year or late last year but if memory serves, his justification for it was 1. by keeping schools open almost 24/7, kids can have a safe place to go to, apparently any other place a kid can go to from after 3 P.M. and on weekends is a death trap waiting to happen or something. And 2. American kids aren't studying hard enough because they're not catching up with students from other countries like China.

Supernova wrote:Well he came up with this one either early this year or late last year but if memory serves, his justification for it was 1. by keeping schools open almost 24/7, kids can have a safe place to go to, apparently any other place a kid can go to from after 3 P.M. and on weekends is a death trap waiting to happen or something. And 2. American kids aren't studying hard enough because they're not catching up with students from other countries like China.

Yeah cause schools have proven to be such bastions of safety! lol

So because American kids don't study enough, we're going to keep them in school for a longer period of time and give them LESS time to study.

Something like that, yeah.

And the safety argument is so stupid, some people have said it WILL be safe for kids who have abusive homes. Uh, no, by keeping schools open longer for that purpose you're only hoping the parents WON'T beat them to death when they finally DO go home. And if the kids aren't going to report what's going on between 8 AM and 3 PM they ain't going to feel encouraged to report it to somebody at 5 or 7 P.M. or on Saturday.

^^^^The safety argument is indeed very stupid.

I think Obama alluded to the fact that we need to do that in our schools because quite frankly....our education system compared with other countries is lacking. We're slipping. Basically IMO, he's saying is that our children aren't up to par academically when it comes those other countries. He's prob. fat-fetched in that idea that we need to extend hours and open on the weekends but you get the gist (at least you should) of what he's trying to say. Something needs to be done. I don't think he's rock solid on it. He's just throwing that idea our there because it works in China and their students leave ours in the dust. Children in this country are twice or maybe three times as likely to be overweight. They sit in the house and play video games. They have parents who had them when they were children themselves so they're most likely not to have any real structure or discipline and the schools are holding teachers responsible for their students not learning a damn thing. He cares about the children of this country and their education. Once again, people attack him for proposing to do something about it and they themselves don't propose a damn thing.

Nystyle709 wrote: He's just throwing that idea our there because it works in China and their students leave ours in the dust. Children in this country are twice or maybe three times as likely to be overweight. They sit in the house and play video games. They have parents who had them when they were children themselves so they're most likely not to have any real structure or discipline and the schools are holding teachers responsible for their students not learning a damn thing. He cares about the children of this country and their education. Once again, people attack him for proposing to do something about it and they themselves don't propose a damn thing.

1. So because one country does something, we need to give into the pressure to be like them? And where does it stop? Yeah they're known for being good academically, but they're also well known for murderering baby girls because they only want boys, should we start adopting that policy too so we can be more like them?

2. 48% of elementary schools in this country have eliminated recess because they don't have the money for equipment and they don't want kids running around instead of studying. You do the math and that takes away a potential 600 hours children could be spending getting exercise replaced with sitting at a desk for those same 600 hours. How much exercise are they going to get there to combat the overweight issue? And gym? Most kids don't even take it, or it's so lax, you can just show up, not do the work, and you pass. I don't see Obama coming up with any ideas to improve that, do you?

3. Structure or no structure doesn't have anything to do with being young parents and even if it did, exactly what would Obama's plan be for that? Go on TV and tell people 'you should not have any kids until you know how to discipline them'?

Kids are already spending too much time in school and they're not getting anywhere BECAUSE they're spending TOO much time there and aren't being given enough time to shake the cobwebs out of their heads at school or have any kind of life of their own outside of it.

Nystyle709 wrote:I think Obama alluded to the fact that we need to do that in our schools because quite frankly....our education system compared with other countries is lacking. We're slipping. Basically IMO, he's saying is that our children aren't up to par academically when it comes those other countries. He's prob. fat-fetched in that idea that we need to extend hours and open on the weekends but you get the gist (at least you should) of what he's trying to say. Something needs to be done. I don't think he's rock solid on it. He's just throwing that idea our there because it works in China and their students leave ours in the dust. Children in this country are twice or maybe three times as likely to be overweight. They sit in the house and play video games. They have parents who had them when they were children themselves so they're most likely not to have any real structure or discipline and the schools are holding teachers responsible for their students not learning a damn thing. He cares about the children of this country and their education. Once again, people attack him for proposing to do something about it and they themselves don't propose a damn thing.

So sitting at a school desk studying things they'll forget the day after the test will make them burn more calories than video games eh?

I was never of the belief that just because there was a problem meant that any SOMETHING that somebody proposes should be welcomed with open arms regardless of how stupid it is. Yes, American schools are struggling academically, but it isn't because kids aren't there long enough. I still would like to hear the logic behind kids benefiting from spending more time in a place that is already not doing a damn thing for them.

I got plenty damn things to propose in his place. So does Supernova. And liberals are one to talk about attacking a president without proposing a damn thing themselves.

Again, spending more hours in school is just another of Obama's dumb ideas. If we want smarter kids, make the 7-8 hours a day kids already spend in school more meaningful instead of adding more time for their brains to be drained of their thinking power.

Exactly. That idea would be like if your kid hated eating broccoli, and you know he needs the nutrients that are in it, but instead of steaming it or putting salt or cheese on it to make it more suitable for eating, just giving the kid 10 pounds of broccoli and saying 'he'll like it now because he has so much of it'. But we all know that kid wouldn't be anymore eager to eat it if nothing's been done to fix it, just as no kid is going to be eager to spend more hours of every day in school if it's the same dead end curricular that will in a few years be good enough to qualify them for flipping burgers somewhere.

^^^^Cheese does make broccoli very good. Then again, I've always been fairly partial to Broccoli prepared right. Anyway, getting off topic.

I agree, more of a broken thing will not make it a good thing.

I believe in quality over quantity, however, I also believe we could increase both quality and quantity.

It’s not about increasing workload. It’s about increasing learning. Our entire educational system is broken. Teachers have become babysitters and tenure has allowed completely unqualified teachers to continue to babysit class after class after class. I also believe we should be tracking our education like that in Germany. In Germany, there are three different levels of schools: vocational, high school, and college prep. By doing this, students are grouped according to similar learning abilities and teachers aren’t forced to teach to the lowest common denominator or deal with unruly students.

Keeping kids engaged and interested should be the number one priority of schools and teachers. Students spend way too much time out of school and summer breaks are entirely too long. It is difficult for parents to arrange activities for their kids for the three months they have off. For the students who don’t have parents finding stuff for them to do, they find stuff to do on their own, which usually results in some sort of trouble.

Education should be a number one priority because without properly educated citizens, we will not be able to run this country in 100 years.

This is just ridiculous. Making school days and hours longer? I mean, this is AMERICA. NOT ASIA. (I am South Korean myself, and I am an honor student. Heh.) I do understand that Obama wants all of us to become successful in life and learn more, but some kids do have lives away from school. After school I always helped my parents with errands and stuff, and then I'd have to do 3 hours of homework. When are they going to have time to do homework now? Then you'll have kids missing dinner. You should also think about how DARK it’s going to be if kids get out of school around 7-8 pm. Some kids have to walk home, and imagine having to walk a long way home in the DARK.

The teachers don’t get paid much, they need a numerous amount of time in order to come up with new lesson plans/correcting tests and or homework. Imagine having to correct about 500 papers within 3 days, along with having to take care of yourself and your family.

..So this is a bad idea.

FightSleep wrote:This is just ridiculous. Making school days and hours longer? I mean, this is AMERICA. NOT ASIA. (I am South Korean myself, and I am an honor student. Heh.) I do understand that Obama wants all of us to become successful in life and learn more, but some kids do have lives away from school. After school I always helped my parents with errands and stuff, and then I'd have to do 3 hours of homework. When are they going to have time to do homework now? Then you'll have kids missing dinner. You should also think about how DARK it’s going to be if kids get out of school around 7-8 pm. Some kids have to walk home, and imagine having to walk a long way home in the DARK.

The teachers don’t get paid much, they need a numerous amount of time in order to come up with new lesson plans/correcting tests and or homework. Imagine having to correct about 500 papers within 3 days, along with having to take care of yourself and your family.

..So this is a bad idea.

Exactly, and what about in the winter when it's pitch dark at 5? And good luck those buses driving home on icy roads at night with dozens of kids in tow and trying not to have an accident. And WHEN are these kids supposed to be with their friends? In school? When? At their lockers for 10 minutes during class? In a good classroom anyway, you're not allowed to talk, or disrupt the class, or interrupt the teacher, so good luck getting any socialization done there. And what about the teenagers who need to get part time jobs after school to start putting away for college and a home of their own or a car or something? At this rate, why doesn't Obama just rule that any public school kids must be taken away from their parents and LIVE at the school until they graduate since it's so obvious he doesn't want them being around their dangerous parents or homes anymore than could ever possibly be helped? As I said before, his own daughters will NEVER have to endure any of this because he has them in private school. So why does he hate public school kids having any kind of life or family outside of school so much?

Dan70 wrote:Keeping kids engaged and interested should be the number one priority of schools and teachers. Students spend way too much time out of school and summer breaks are entirely too long. It is difficult for parents to arrange activities for their kids for the three months they have off. For the students who don’t have parents finding stuff for them to do, they find stuff to do on their own, which usually results in some sort of trouble.

I hardly think this is true. Kids need time off. I don't think we give them that much time off. Time off is not what is hurting our education; it's the lack of education they are getting while they are IN school. We can have perfectly intelligent kids with our current school schedule, we don't need them in school longer to make it work. If we do, it's a sign that the school system just can't handle educating kids anymore.

I agree education is important for our future, but we need to go about it in an effective way.

I believe our President is correct in his thinking, but going at it in the wrong way. Expending the school day’s hour would be ridiculous and be no help at all with family matters, learning matters, etc.

However, if we extend the number of school days from180 to at least 200 or more, and keep the hours at 8 hours a day, then I would support this notion all the way!

However if kids aren't learning sic'em 180 days out of the year, exactly how much more are they supposed to get out of 20 more days with nothing to make them anymore inspired or eager to learn?