The English language in the United States

Should the U.S just throw in the towel and make it mandatory for all public school students to learn Spanish in school or should there be an official requirement for all immigrants to learn as well as for all business to be conducted in English? I single out Spanish because I don't think anyone ever had to "press 2" to continue in French, German, Korean or Swahili.

I think mandating Spanish is a huge mistake. Immigrants should learn English. Nuff said.

Originally the English were the immigrants. But that said, I don't think if you go to another country they need to fall over themselves to accomodate YOU, YOU'RE the one making the move so YOU should be the one learning how to adapt. I would not go over to France or Italy or Russia if I couldn't speak the language.

No. English (which should have been made into the country's official language) is still the language that over 80% of the country speaks. Spanish shouldn't be forced on anyone who isn't interested in learning it.

Spanish shouldn't be forced on anyone who isn't interested in learning it.

Should it be forced on anyone who comes to live in the U.S., legally or illegally to learn English? Should there be a national law or amendment to the constitution prohibiting the use or severely limiting the use of any language other than English to conduct public and private business similar to Quebec's Charter of the French Language?

Supernova wrote:Originally the English were the immigrants. But that said, I don't think if you go to another country they need to fall over themselves to accomodate YOU, YOU'RE the one making the move so YOU should be the one learning how to adapt. I would not go over to France or Italy or Russia if I couldn't speak the language.

Supernova my sweet said it all!

When I was in HS i took french and my teacher who had been to france said that the french didnt take kindly to foreigners coming to their country and not embracing their culture, especially the language. I feel the same way about english in the U.S. If you live here, you should know it. I shouldnt have to carry around a english to spanish dictionary to try and understand the guys taking my order at McDonalds. Far as bilingual education goes. I think its always good to speak more than 1 language but it shouldnt be mandatory if you know the main language of the land.

alan smithee wrote:Should the U.S just throw in the towel and make it mandatory for all public school students to learn Spanish in school or should there be an official requirement for all immigrants to learn as well as for all business to be conducted in English? I single out Spanish because I don't think anyone ever had to "press 2" to continue in French, German, Korean or Swahili.

I don't think it should ever be required, for as long as English remains the dominate language of US society. Encouraged, perhaps, but not required.

alan smithee wrote:

Should it be forced on anyone who comes to live in the U.S., legally or illegally to learn English?

Yes. It should be expected of all persons living in America to be able to speak the English language when they're out and dealing with the general, English-speaking public. When in Rome.

Should there be a national law or amendment to the constitution prohibiting the use or severely limiting the use of any language other than English to conduct public and private business similar to Quebec's Charter of the French Language?

No. It shouldn't be THAT extreme. If people want to speak their native tongue inside their own home, more power to them. If there is a group of Spanish-speaking people out and about and they want to speak Spanish amongst each other, that's fine too....but the common language here is English. It's their responsibility to learn and know it. I shouldn't have to learn a new language to accommodate them.

I hope it's okay if I chime in with how I feel about speaking English (and French) in Canada. We have two official languages and I think if you are living in Canada and an immigrant or with landed refugee status, you should be required to learn either language. To not learn the language is disrespectful to me. If I lived overseas for an extended time, it would be rude of me to expect to function only with my own native language. I would do all that I could to learn the local language. Years ago, I worked in a donut/coffee shop and this one customer came in and pointed to the sign behind me and said "beef". That was the only word she seemed to know and I couldn't figure out if she was trying to order a beef sandwich or the beef vegetable soup. After several very frustrating minutes getting nowhere, I finally just placed the order for the soup and she seemed happy. After maybe 10 minutes, she then left her table and went to the bathroom, taking everything (coat, etc.) with her. She came back and kept pointing to the table. It took our assistant manage another few minutes to figure out that what she was trying to tell us was that her order had "disappeared". The cleaning lady apparently thought she was finished and cleaned up. Her lack of English was such a handicap that it really made me think about the importance of being able to communicate in whatever language the locals speak.

I work in a school and many of our ESL students have one or both parents who don't bother to even try and learn English and just rely on the kids to do all of the translating. It's so isolating for the parents and it's unfair pressure to put on the kids. Learning a language is hard, but if you're going to a country that doesn't speak your language, I think it's important to develop even a basic level of skill if you plan on living there for any length of time.

Good perspective TSJ!

Marc™ wrote:

Should there be a national law or amendment to the constitution prohibiting the use or severely limiting the use of any language other than English to conduct public and private business similar to Quebec's Charter of the French Language?

No. It shouldn't be THAT extreme. If people want to speak their native tongue inside their own home, more power to them. If there is a group of Spanish-speaking people out and about and they want to speak Spanish amongst each other, that's fine too....but the common language here is English. It's their responsibility to learn and know it. I shouldn't have to learn a new language to accommodate them.

I wasn't suggesting that immigrants should be forced to abandon their native language. My "beef" is that public and private entities in the U.S. remove the incentive...obligation, whatever, for immigrants to assimilate. U.S. businesses what those dollars too and don’t car if you have a green card or you snuck across the border. Does it bother anyone else to walk into a Sears or Home Depot and have to look for the sign written in English? Maybe it bothers you to walk into either of those examples to begin with so please feel free to substitute a merchant of your choosing. My original (sarcastic) comment about teaching Spanish in school is because Hispanics are now 16% of the U.S. population so I don’t think bi-lingual signs are going away. It’s too politically incorrect to remove them.

alan smithee wrote:

Marc™ wrote:

No. It shouldn't be THAT extreme. If people want to speak their native tongue inside their own home, more power to them. If there is a group of Spanish-speaking people out and about and they want to speak Spanish amongst each other, that's fine too....but the common language here is English. It's their responsibility to learn and know it. I shouldn't have to learn a new language to accommodate them.

I wasn't suggesting that immigrants should be forced to abandon their native language. My "beef" is that public and private entities in the U.S. remove the incentive...obligation, whatever, for immigrants to assimilate. U.S. businesses what those dollars too and don’t car if you have a green card or you snuck across the border. Does it bother anyone else to walk into a Sears or Home Depot and have to look for the sign written in English? Maybe it bothers you to walk into either of those examples to begin with so please feel free to substitute a merchant of your choosing. My original (sarcastic) comment about teaching Spanish in school is because Hispanics are now 16% of the U.S. population so I don’t think bi-lingual signs are going away. It’s too politically incorrect to remove them.

I get what you mean. My position is that in the US, every citizen should be expected to know English and speak it amongst English speaking people. If they want to retain their language in their own intimate circle, that's fine with me. But I can't co-sign mandating English speaking people learning a second language in order to better communicate with others who don't speak English, or don't speak it well....when someone in a place where one language is common, it's their responsibility to adapt to the community.

I don't feel that any language other than English should be mandatory in the US. However, learning other languages should be offered to those who wish to expand their minds.

Well, here is comment from the guy who lives in a foreign country. As a native English speaker, I am now a minority in Miami-Dade County. I was here when stores had signs that read "Se Habla Espańol." I would now expect a "We Speak English" sign but they don't bother. Right now Spanish is the dominant second language in the U.S. (primary language where I live - you cannot get certain jobs without being bilingual).

Anyhow, I have always been an advocate of a "Lingua Franca" (as long as it wasn't French). As much as the Indians hated the Brits, they kept English as their common language because of international expediency. Otherwise everyone would have to learn Urdo, Gujarati, Marathi, Hindi and about 80 languages.

So yes, they should make English the national language and expect businesses and government agencies to use it.

BTW, I am not conversant but I do know travel Spanish - learned it in Centro-America so I can get boletas, cuartos y comidas without being totally dependent on finding a translator.

I appreciate all your replies and I'm encouraged that I think you unanimously reject my sarcastic suggestion for abandoning English. Unfortunately our government has not followed through on Theodore Roosevelt's recommendations.

"In the first place we should insist that the immigrant who comes here in good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he shall be treated on an exact equity with everyone else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birthplace or origin. But this is predicated upon the man's becoming an American and nothing but an American. There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag, and this excludes the red flag which symbolizes all wars against liberty and civilization, just as much as it excludes any flag of a nation to which we are hostile. We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language...and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people." Theodore Roosevelt in a letter to the American Defense Society in 1919.

"Every immigrant who comes here should be required within five years to learn English or to leave the country," he said in a statement to the Kansas City Star in 1918. "English should be the only language taught or used in the public schools."

"In the first place we should insist that the immigrant who comes here in good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he shall be treated on an exact equity with everyone else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birthplace or origin. But this is predicated upon the man's becoming an American and nothing but an American. There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag, and this excludes the red flag which symbolizes all wars against liberty and civilization, just as much as it excludes any flag of a nation to which we are hostile. We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language...and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people." Theodore Roosevelt in a letter to the American Defense Society in 1919.

"Every immigrant who comes here should be required within five years to learn English or to leave the country," he said in a statement to the Kansas City Star in 1918. "English should be the only language taught or used in the public schools."

Like I said earlier, I do not live in the Estados Unidos any more. That sentiment of a simpler time in America has been roundly ignored in South Florida, where I have seen Haitians put the stars and stripes upside down at our pole at work, where I have seen Cuban flags flying without an accompanying American Flag or flying above it (BIG breach of flag protocol), where citizens who identify as Cuban-American have actually dropped the American.

There are now streets in Miami named after ppl I know nothing about. Pisses me off that it took years of struggle just to get a street (usually one going thru some ghetto) named after Martin Luther King but now Haitians and Cubans who were not a part of the United States have streets in MY city named after them.

We Americans, it seems have assimilated (or acquiesed) to the immigrants.

I feel like any immigrant who comes to the US and expects to have a job and life here has an obligation to learn the English language.

However, I also find it embarrassing that only 9% of Americans are bilingual. I think we should start secondary language education in first grade and continue it up through college.

Shale wrote:

Like I said earlier, I do not live in the Estados Unidos any more. That sentiment of a simpler time in America has been roundly ignored in South Florida, where I have seen Haitians put the stars and stripes upside down at our pole at work, where I have seen Cuban flags flying without an accompanying American Flag or flying above it (BIG breach of flag protocol), where citizens who identify as Cuban-American have actually dropped the American.

There are now streets in Miami named after ppl I know nothing about. Pisses me off that it took years of struggle just to get a street (usually one going thru some ghetto) named after Martin Luther King but now Haitians and Cubans who were not a part of the United States have streets in MY city named after them.

We Americans, it seems have assimilated (or acquiesed) to the immigrants.

Apathy will be the end of us.

Supernova wrote:Originally the English were the immigrants. But that said, I don't think if you go to another country they need to fall over themselves to accomodate YOU, YOU'RE the one making the move so YOU should be the one learning how to adapt. I would not go over to France or Italy or Russia if I couldn't speak the language.